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| Dhat Shi Cray |
Posted on 11-01-12, 06:05 pm
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Local mod
 Karma: 100 Posts: 3/49 Since: 10-31-12 Last post: 3478 days Last view: 3467 days |
Hey all-
I'm still kinda new to DOTA 2 and one of the heroes I've had my eye on for a while is Naga Siren. I tested her out in a practice game and didn't do as well as I feel I could have. I feel like her workflow/skill uses are more diverse then how I utilized them. Can anyone give me some fundamentals to work on in regards to playing Naga at a higher level of play? Thanks. |
| fallenelf86 |
Posted on 11-01-12, 06:14 pm
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 Giant Red KoopaThe HTML Wizard  Karma: 100 Posts: 527/1322 Since: 03-03-12 Last post: 2827 days Last view: 1980 days |
Hmm, Naga isn't a hero I play a lot, but during TI2 saw a ton of play. During TI2 I saw a lot of Radiance builds on her, which personally, I didn't really like. I like building her a little tankier for early aggression in the early/mid game going tranquils, vanguard, diffusal blade. Grabbing the Tranquils allows you to survive in lane with relatively no problem. The Vanguard makes her and her illusions tankier and the diffusal give the mana burn and purge. Purge is so powerful when combined with her other skill sets. Puge a target, illusions, attack/riptide and burn all the mana, net as they try to escape.
From there I like to grab agi items like manta and butterfly. Late game I'd swap the vanguard for a heart. As I mentioned I don't play Naga a ton so someone else might have a much better build. |
| Dhat Shi Cray |
Posted on 11-01-12, 06:24 pm
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Karma: 100 Posts: 4/49 Since: 10-31-12 Last post: 3478 days Last view: 3467 days |
Yeah, I def build vanguard, but i typically build arcanes so i can use my spells more. I did try the radiance build but i think u may be right about it. I'm still not used to microing units but i heard somewhere u can use the illusins to farm the jungle while u farm the lane. Is that factual?
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| Gambit |
Posted on 11-01-12, 06:32 pm (rev. 3)
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Full mod
Karma: 110 Posts: 49/79 Since: 09-17-12 Last post: 3443 days Last view: 3061 days |
Purpose:
Late game carry with a handful of team initiation. Basically farm, farm and use your Siren to either initiate team fights (siren to sleep enemies, your team fights simply walk into position and fight the enemy when song ends) favorable with good team combos that benefit from Sirens setup (Tidehunter, Enigma, Lina, Leshrac, Kunkka). Provides a lot of pushing power/farming late game with illusions and has a disable that goes through BKB making her good against most BKB carries (Anti-Mage, Lycan, Chaos Knight, etc). Playstyle: Can be played either aggressively by setting up team fights, catching the enemy team with their pants down and pushing, or defensively by using your ultimate to escape from ganks or unexpected team fights. Needs early game farm to be effective, so she needs a safe lane. Needs to spend early/mid game farming with a splash of ganks and team fights whenever ultimate is off cooldown. Later on can farm/push multiple waves and take teamfights. Is not the best late game carry due to her illusions relative fragility unless the enemy team lacks AoE, however counters certain heroes really well due to illusion mana burn from diffusal. Lacks the mobility of other carries, making her much focused on big team engagements late game. Items: Arcane Boots, Vanguard, Diffusal/Radiance, Mantastyle/Heart is the way to go. Possibly substitute Arcane for Tranquil + Soul ring. Posted by Dhat Shi Cray Yeah, I def build vanguard, but i typically build arcanes so i can use my spells more. I did try the radiance build but i think u may be right about it. I'm still not used to microing units but i heard somewhere u can use the illusins to farm the jungle while u farm the lane. Is that factual? Yes, that's true. Every illusion effectively extends your Rip Tide AoE around them, so you can use that to easily farm the jungle or even other lanes with illusions. With proper micro and items she can rival an Anti-Mage in terms of creeps per minute late game. However, while Anti-Mage only needs a Battlefury to flash farm, Naga needs slightly more farm/exp to do that quickly, but it's defintely possible to keep up. Keep in mind that if you go Radiance you need absolutely stellar farm because you need Vanguard, Arcane and Radiance by at least 25 minutes, if not sooner. |
| fallenelf86 |
Posted on 11-01-12, 06:35 pm (rev. 1)
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Giant Red Koopa The HTML Wizard Karma: 100 Posts: 528/1322 Since: 03-03-12 Last post: 2827 days Last view: 1980 days |
I've done arcanes before too, it's definitely really helpful with spell spamming. It really depends on the lane.
Radiance is mainly used if you're going for a farm build. It's true that you can send your illusions into the jungle and basically position them next to creeps, then rip tide and clear 3-4 camps at once. While this is great for farming, I personally think it's not that great in terms of using her skill set. Edit: I was waiting for Gambit to chime in! Dhat Shi Cray if you're interested in working on Naga play a bit, we're getting our coaching section up and running on Sunday. Throw a post in there and we'll have one of our coaches like Gambit help you out! |
| Dhat Shi Cray |
Posted on 11-01-12, 08:39 pm
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Local mod
Karma: 100 Posts: 5/49 Since: 10-31-12 Last post: 3478 days Last view: 3467 days |
Sounds great! Can't wait!
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Posted on 11-01-12, 10:13 pm
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"Pussy Crusher"
 Karma: 100 Posts: 139/636 Since: 05-22-12 Last post: 3356 days Last view: 3039 days |
Naga Siren isn't my go to in terms of farming, but people who farm alot sure get used to out carrying a naga siren.
And thats one thing i think about naga siren, if your going to have her be your only carry on your team, you better have ALOT of damage from the rest of your team, sure she has illusions but in terms of raw damage she cant stack up to an antimage or a faceless void. One thing i can say about naga though is she has THE best skill for setting up that wombo combo your team drafted http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0XDFwaYCYo <---------- wombo combo What you can do about naga's lack of damage though, is give her some good items, people have suggested radiance, manta, diffusal, heart, theyre all good. To also help her lack of damage youve got the help of summoning those mirror images, this makes farming items SOO fast. by no means is it a battlefury antimage but its the next best thing! get that super fast radiance, hit your Q to summon those images and send them into lanes, the jungle wherever you want to get them getting you farm, it might sound like a daunting task at first but taking it one illusion at a time to where you want them to go is all youve got to do! no 400apm micro required! AKA you dont have to be this guy! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbpCLqryN-Q Another problem you can fix with her too is that she's pretty slow! boots of travel, phase boots, yasha, or manta style (using that yasha) are all great options, this gives you some good manuverability so you can farm really fast! because with naga you really want to be farming, you need your items to be able to go toe to toe with the enemy especially if your your only teams carry! If this didnt make sense just lemme know id love to help you out, im pretty sure that statement speaks for all of us really, not just myself! |
| fallenelf86 |
Posted on 11-01-12, 10:37 pm
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Giant Red Koopa The HTML Wizard Karma: 100 Posts: 533/1322 Since: 03-03-12 Last post: 2827 days Last view: 1980 days |
Posted by _ATLAS Naga Siren isn't my go to in terms of farming, but people who farm alot sure get used to out carrying a naga siren. And thats one thing i think about naga siren, if your going to have her be your only carry on your team, you better have ALOT of damage from the rest of your team, sure she has illusions but in terms of raw damage she cant stack up to an antimage or a faceless void. One thing i can say about naga though is she has THE best skill for setting up that wombo combo your team drafted http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0XDFwaYCYo <---------- wombo combo What you can do about naga's lack of damage though, is give her some good items, people have suggested radiance, manta, diffusal, heart, theyre all good. To also help her lack of damage youve got the help of summoning those mirror images, this makes farming items SOO fast. by no means is it a battlefury antimage but its the next best thing! get that super fast radiance, hit your Q to summon those images and send them into lanes, the jungle wherever you want to get them getting you farm, it might sound like a daunting task at first but taking it one illusion at a time to where you want them to go is all youve got to do! no 400apm micro required! AKA you dont have to be this guy! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbpCLqryN-Q Another problem you can fix with her too is that she's pretty slow! boots of travel, phase boots, yasha, or manta style (using that yasha) are all great options, this gives you some good manuverability so you can farm really fast! because with naga you really want to be farming, you need your items to be able to go toe to toe with the enemy especially if your your only teams carry! If this didnt make sense just lemme know id love to help you out, im pretty sure that statement speaks for all of us really, not just myself! Her wombo isn't as scary as it used to be, i.e. dark seer+enigma. Naga doesn't lack damage. Her base damage got a small nerf, but as with any illusion based hero, building stat items is a sure fire to enhance your damage. Naga isn't a hero I'd grab straight damage items on. As for farming the jungle without a radiance, it's possible but extremely difficult to do so. More than likely, your illusion will die very quickly due to her low str gain. As Gambit mentioned, unless you're amazing at farming, diffusal is the way to go. Naga isn't too slow, and I can't see myself ever building phase boots on her, there are a just of better options. As far as building yasha/manta, manta is core on her. Doesn't matter what build you go. However, I'd suggest diffusal->manta->butterfly |
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Posted on 11-02-12, 12:04 am
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"Pussy Crusher"
Karma: 100 Posts: 142/636 Since: 05-22-12 Last post: 3356 days Last view: 3039 days |
Her wombo isn't as scary as it used to be, i.e. dark seer+enigma. Dark seer did get a nerf, and most of the time if your getting naga you wont get enigma.. just from my experience, but i see where your coming from. Naga doesn't lack damage. Her base damage got a small nerf Minus 12 is more than a small nerf my friend it makes those early last hits that much harder because she was only hitting high 40s low 50s after early stat items, quelling blade is pretty much a must unless your uncontested I can't see myself ever building phase boots on her, there are a just of better options. Just my personal preference since i like the damage when im farming, if im not doing that and im farming well then im going to go tranquil boots so i can get a faster radiance or perseverance for my linkinsphere. Like i said, it all comes down to in game situation and personal preference, like radiance rushes you try to tank up fast and get some regen so you dont die as easily when your trying to save the 3.8k gold. I like the phase boots because it lets me last hit in a lane better and it gives me the small burst of movement speed when i need to run away and dont have my ult |
| Dhat Shi Cray |
Posted on 11-02-12, 08:07 pm
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Local mod
Karma: 100 Posts: 7/49 Since: 10-31-12 Last post: 3478 days Last view: 3467 days |
Lots of good information here. Thanks everyone! Also, I don;t think I have any chance of being that APM guy. That was just ridiculous.
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| fallenelf86 |
Posted on 11-02-12, 08:09 pm
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Giant Red Koopa The HTML Wizard Karma: 100 Posts: 539/1322 Since: 03-03-12 Last post: 2827 days Last view: 1980 days |
As I mentioned earlier, we just got our coaching section started. If you wanted to pair up with a coach for some one on one sessions to improve with Naga, post here:
http://dotanoobs.com/forum/forum.php?id=15 |
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Posted on 11-02-12, 10:28 pm
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Deputy Smiles
 Karma: 115 Posts: 317/945 Since: 05-08-12 Last post: 2842 days Last view: 2828 days |
One thing that I didn't see mentioned is Naga's usefulness in the laning phase. Similar to CK, she has some great initiation for a carry in the first ten minutes or so.
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Posted on 11-02-12, 11:17 pm
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"Pussy Crusher"
Karma: 100 Posts: 148/636 Since: 05-22-12 Last post: 3356 days Last view: 3039 days |
She has a use in her net, but with her riptide being nerfed and with her -12 base damage she lost alot of her potential, shes very niche now. like i watched a game today with empire vs zero, and naga was picked for the sole purpose of stopping black hole or for a chasing abilty to close gaps for empires batrider and TA
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